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TOPIC: London Airshow 2006 Cancelled.

London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 6 months ago #2087

Unfortunately, the London Airshow has been cancelled for 2006. I doubt that this show will ever be back, unless there is some new organizers found. The current people just dont seem to have the passion to put on a show.

www.londonairshow.com/

Paul
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 6 months ago #2090

  • goodro
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Paul,
The current people just dont seem to have the passion to put on a show.

I doubt it is soley that reason. I bet it is more that they got the calculator out and confirmed what they suspected. Nobody loves airshows more than I do, but the sad fact is they cost more than they make. Insurance costs, the price of fuel (until recently) have made airshows expensive.

This year alone, off the top of my head I can say that two major Candian Forces Bases that cancelled their airshows (Moose Jaw and Trenton) along with Winnipeg and Red Deer to name a few. Ottawa, where I live, used to have a huge show. Now, after several years off, we have a small show at a private airport about 25 minutes outside of the city. I love it, but I can sit and watch Cessnas do circuits all day; many others are dissapointed and once they see the lineup for the show, they decide to stay home. A lot of people here used to drive to Trenton (Quinte) to get their \"fix\" until it shut down. Most end up doing the five hour drive to go to CIAS in Toronto every September where they know it will be a big show.

I hope this doesn't happen in London but I think times are changing unfortunately. I personally feel that it is only a matter of time before they become more of a circus type tour where they are in town one year and not the next; if that.<br><br>Post edited by: goodro, at: 22:32z - 2005/11/19
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 6 months ago #2174

Hi goodro,

Sounds like you are correct about the cost grounding the show (just a bit of an emotional opinion in my first post). I was just watching the local news here in London, and they had a big story about the situation. They estimated that the cost to put on the show is now about $400K!! The story said the show would be grounded for the next 3 or 4 years, and then may be resurrected then (though I'm sure on a smaller scale than past years). Oh well, at least I'm close to the US border...I think I'll be going over there for my airshow fixes next year. BTW, The Snowbirds schedule for 2006 will be out at the beginning of December, so it will be interesting to see what Canadian locations they'll be flying at.

Paul
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 6 months ago #2175

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Doesn't suprise me Paul and trust me I know how you feel. You are in the early stages of shock. You have time to cope but trust me, when the weekend that the airshow usually falls on comes around, you start to suffer withdrawal symptoms. :blink:

A while back I started this thread that didn't really seem to catch on.

www.aviation.ca/component/option,com_sim...iew/id,376/catid,42/

Since then I have seen other posts mainly anger toward the cancellation of the Moose Jaw show.
The Snowbirds schedule for 2006 will be out at the
beginning of December, so it will be interesting to see what Canadian
locations they'll be flying at.

I agree. The venues are becoming limited. I would expect now that they will perform at a handful of Canadian dates (along with the Canada Day celebrations) and maybe add some south of the border shows. Of course, if last year is any indication of the year ahead, numerous air shows will be added to the schedule and removed once they are cancelled.

This year we had our first show after several years of and the only jet in the show was a CF-18. The Snowbirds weren't part of the lineup (major dissapointment to all) and I am sure it was because they wanted to keep costs down. They are usually hear every year we have an airshow. The rest of the show was small aerobatic planes (which are personally a favorite but they do nothing in the way of drawing the general public), WWII Aircraft and Helo's. A far cry from the day that we had F-14,15,16,18,117 B-1, 2 and 52 along with the Snowbirds, Mig-29's, Thunderbirds. Granted, they weren't all in the same year but consecutive years.

I can tell you that I knew two organizers here in Ottawa (who have since thrown in the towel on organizing airshows) and they tell me that the hardest part of a show is getting the organizers to commit or stick. A lot will withdraw as time passes.

Which brings me to the original question in my other thread - are airshows an endangered species?<br><br>Post edited by: goodro, at: 18:32z - 2005/11/23
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 1 month ago #4794

  • graham don
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It is a bunch of crap to cancel this show 'again'. Last year's lame reason given, an election that didn't materialize, just didn't cut it. The organizers lost the passion for airshows (sad that Tom Walsh couldn't financially keep up his shows from the 'good ol' days'!) and didn't have the drive to get the job done. The admission fees charged and the attendance I saw at the great show put on in 2004 would indicate that finances were 'not' the major issue. The days of London, Hamilton, Trenton, Ottawa and Niagara Falls on literally consecutive weekends is sadly a thing of the past. The cancellation of shows at air force bases is 'not' the same as a privately funded show as the defence budget 'pr fund' is a major part of that decision. London relied on volunteers that were eager and willing to be a part of an airshow. I feel that political bumbling among the organizers is the primary reason that this show was cancelled. It's time-consumimg to contact the sponsors and repeatedly 'badger' the United States bases for participation. The more years without a show, the less people that will be there when there is a show (last years' snowbird/cf-18 'makeup event' I don't consider a real show). My home-town of Oshawa has a steadily growing show that is primarily a trade-show (Farnborough for kitplanes) but has the potential to become a real show (if the residents in close proximity to the airport don't whine too much). Oh well, get out the 1988 program and remember a line-up of 25 Phantoms as you see the 'ghosts of airshows past' on the empty tarmac at London 'again'. Going to be a long summer!
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 1 month ago #4796

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I guess Trenton is not going to have one again? The last one I went to there was in 2003 I think?

I remember going to the Ottawa show, (which was huge when it was at YOW) then Trenton having a few weeks off and heading to CIAS in Toronto. Ottawa used to attract large crowds even on Canada Day weekend. A few years of rain, political stuff and anti-war protests and that was that. Or so it seemed anyway.

I miss those shows sooooo much! Times are a changin'.
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 1 month ago #4810

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The other part of the equation is - there ain't new stuf to see!

When I was growing up, god bless my parents but they took me to each and every CNE Airshow every year. I saw Voodoos, Super Sabres, A4s, Chinooks, B52s, the brand new F15, newer F18, Concorde, Vulcan, etc etc. Aviation, despite fuel and economics, was continually evolving, and every 3-4 years had a new set of wings coming through - be it commercial or military.

Now - you have EADs (Airbus) and Boeing. No one except enthusiasts enjoy the classical stuff, and everyone considers airplanes as they do cars - every day items.

Car shows are on they way down too. no one cares...just give them something economical and with a bit of longevity, and people don't need to see the launch of the new GTO. They don't care.

To answer your question, yeah, airshows are on the way out. Italy does it right. One, maybe 2 major airshows a year. One day events. period. Economical, worth the cash outlay, and they make a killing when 200 to 400 thousand people show up. Do the same in Canada. Make Abbotsford and Toronto the must-be places for airshows. Makes sure they have statics. Invest in two locations (maybe three) and make worth everyone's while. It will suck if you live hours away from any of them, but if you make it an event other than just 3 hours of noise, people will come.

From the operators point of view, organizers ain't handing out the cherries they used to. Nowadays an performer has to foot his/her own bill. Not exactly good business sense. Best hosting I ever had was Muskoka and Hamilton. My crew made sure we paid them back in going the extra mile for the public. That's what's it's all about.

Oh well. Back to reality.

Illo
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 13 years 1 month ago #4822

  • AndyJ
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forget Toronto, London is the perfect site for a major airshow... it has the population base, runway and relatively quiet airspace! The truth is that there simply cant be London one weekend followed by Hamilton a few weekends later anymore... but the frustrating part is that london shut down for two consecutive years after one amazing show in '04... After a few 'light' years London gained momentum as a must see military hardware airshow and the prospect of US Jet teams, great ACC demos and Navy demo participation to top off the usual great participation of the snowbirds and CF-18 demo... we had some great years ahead, making this a pretty darn tough pill to swallow... is an airshow an easy venture? no... but there are so many people out there willing to volounteer their time to make an airshow in London come together and as '04 demonstrated there are many people willing to pay to see such gatherings of military hardware... at any rate, end rant!

What shows you planning on hitting Paul?
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 12 years 11 months ago #5590

  • Jacques from Montreal
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re: Your commentary about The organizers lost the passion for Airshows (sad that Tom Walsh couldn't financially keep up his shows from the 'good ol' days'!) and didn't have the drive to get the job done. I can only say that I had many conversations over the year with Tom and you won't find a more enthusiastic sole and qualified person in Canada that could do what he did for the Airshows industry in Canada.

I was 1991 Military aircraft coordinator for Montreal Airshow, being an ex Canadian Air Force ATC (Moose-Jaw) I worked first hand with the very first Snowbirds team,1971 Moose-Jaw Airshow. I have never missed an Airshow since 1971 until the 1998 Montreal Airshow, then Montreal went dead. And the London Air show was way at the top of the list of Canadian Airshows. The reason was the organization, they did a hell of a job working as a team, which was the envy of many other organizations. And looking from the outside I could only admire the leadership of Mr. Walsh, he just was a master at what he did, he had the passion.

The reasons are politics and money, and rivalry simply said it is not the lack of interest in aviation it is the cost are way too high for organization to sustain the events. I can recall having a conversation with Tom (I forgot the year) where the London Airshow got cnx because of weather and the cost where still there but the crowd was not. And with half or no revenue you are in the red (deeply).

Most of those guys that put together Airshows do it because they just love aviation, however the amount of work involve to put an airshow together is phenomenal. And the reward are not monetary looking at the amount of work involved but the main one is the accomplishment of a job well done. It is a passion not a job and these days there aren’t too many passionate people, and it is so easy to be a side line coach.

Being involved with the actual inner workings for only a short year I can tell you that you have to be a unconditional love of those Flying machine to sustain the grief of all the things that can and will go wrong.

I had 6 weeks in 1991 brought US military 28 aircrafts to Montreal, normally it takes a year, I got lucky with the American, but more so I just did not accept or comprehended the word “ No “ so I kept on going. There are so many things that could and likely will go wrong in attempting that line of work that most normal people would not even try to start such a project.

But thank heaven there where the people like Tom Walsh and many others that kept the crowds coming year after year.

I personally never met Tom Walsh we spoke over the phone for many years, and I felt so sad when he got shafted by some people in his own city, but that is unfortunately sometimes how this business goes. The same story happened in Montreal and that was the end of a beautiful story. In these days simply the cost of fuel will kill most organizations, the insurance, the lodging to mention a few.

Plus you are competing with US Airshows and the connections that an organization has to have to bring the US Military in Canada is no longer there, it is sad but true.

Organization like London and there close competitors Hamilton and Toronto could not sustain the heavy cost and also the demand put on US Military to provide all the flying assets they required on the same close proximity.

The only fortunate thing for me is that I videotaped 8 different Airshows between 1991 and 1998 and was fortunate enough (It is true that the Military customized Flight suit with the F-18 insignia) helped me to get some superb shots thanks to DND that provided me close access to Aircrafts. And also thanks to the Air Museum at CFB Bagotville that digitized 14 CD’s from Video to CD’s I can now watch those Airshows as if I was right on the tarmac again.

That is my fix.

Jacques Seguin Montreal
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 12 years 11 months ago #5597

Jacques,

Everything you said about Tom Walsh is very true. Unfortunately, he hasn't been involved with the London show since 1998. I have also known Tom for some time (he is a neighbour of mine), and have volunteered with his shows in Sarnia in the early 2000's. You wont find a more knowledgable person about aircraft anywhere. I really miss the shows he brought to London in the past.

Paul

FYI, Tom is very involved with \"Thunder over Michigan\", one of the premier warbird shows in the US, run by the Yankee Air Museum outside of Detroit. If you get a chance to go to this show, by all means go! I've been going there for the past 4 years, and it is fantastic!!
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 12 years 11 months ago #5598

  • Jacques from Montreal
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In reply to your comment Makes sure they have statics. Invest in two locations (maybe three) and make worth everyone's while. It will suck if you live hours away from any of them, but if you make it an event other than just 3 hours of noise, people will come.

You suggest Toronto, the Pearson airport is the other side of the 401 the flybys are nearby the CNE grounds so it is a no go, no brainer. Plus from their website Can I view the aircraft before or after the show on the ground or is there a static display? Unfortunately due to strict security regulations at Pearson International and City Centre Airports no parked, or static display is possible for the Canadian International Air Show.

The only airport close by is Hamilton and having lived in Stoney Creek and having nearly signed for the (War Heritage Museum and their cute Flight Suit) at the time anybody working for their organization was a Col (ya for sure) it won’t fly. Beside getting there is hell. So on the East coast what do you have left . We did have a Kitchener Air show once for Oktoberfest but the runway at Waterloo Wellington is too short. So you have London left and we all know what happened there , at least us in that kind of business.

I never spoke to the Toronto organization, I would assume they have some good sponsors specially when it coincide with CNE and they have the population. Because nobody in their right mind would want to organize an Air show if the crowd can see the aircrafts and speak with the pilots. But TO has managed over the years. They must throw a hell of a party, as I recall I was in one of them in 1983 when we got the delivery of our first F-18 but that is another story.

So in Ontario you are shot, forget Quebec, I was part of the Montreal Airshow organization and it was doing ok until we got ADM (Aerport de Montreal ) then it when to hell. The last 1998 Air show I gave a ride on Monday to an F-16 US Pilot that had no transportation to his jet. They didn’t know screw ball about Airshows. I still have a great video of a lineup of a C-5 Galaxy , in front of a Learjet and multitude of other poor Jet jockeys waiting for over an hour at 32 Celsius so they could park them. No wonder the yanks don’t want to show up anymore.

Beside there are money considerations I was part of a group that wanted to re-instated the Montreal Airshows I had a discussion with Bombardier Lear jets, I could not convinced them at the price of 2 million dollar per day (that is the price it cost Bombardier to park an aircraft for display 1999 prices) simply because they can make more money bringing their jets to potential customers. In Montreal we have Bombardier Business Jets, Pratt Withney and Bell Helicopters manufactures, I met them all and no go.

So good luck in Ontario, not trying to be pessimistic I love aviation it’s in my blood but it isn’t big business and it does not bring revenue.
This unfortunately is reality, the Quebec city Air show this past couple weeks was a flop (bad weather) and poor turnout. If Vancouver and Toronto can swing it that is great. I will always have great memory of seeing the SR-71 Blackbird making a slow pass over lake Ontario, and I will always remember seeing Concord taking off out of Toronto Intl airport just as I was driving beside the airport (luck of the Irish) and I am not Irish with is nose down over the 401.

Cheers Toronto you still have an Air show you can enjoy.

Jacques
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Re:London Airshow 2006 Cancelled. 12 years 11 months ago #5599

  • Jacques from Montreal
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Hey Paul thks for the news about Tom, say hi to him next time you bump in to him. I knew he could not stay long away from aircrafts it is in his blood. What a great guy and the aviations fans in London should erect a statue for what he did to promote aviation in Canada.

Just think how many pilots flying today got their inspirations from airshows like the London Airshow and all the rows of F-4's and other schemes he had.

He and his organisation (there are many people involved to put such a great show) and they are all crucial to the success of the event, from the person that bring the aircrafts in to the responsables of the parking. You could simply not have an Airshow without a Team, Tom was the Chef d'orchestre, but he had an hell of a band.

It is so sad how we threat the people that have visions we destroy them, jealosy envy whatever, then if not enough we say they lack of courage. I would chalenge anybody to try it for just a week, and we will see what you may write after just one week.

By Paul and say hi to the Walsh familly

Jacques
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Re: Atrie krediti interneta 1 year 1 week ago #22602

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